This is for Chang-a-long....

[Nancy]

I knew you'd find me here
And this is oh so "queer"
But it's a way for all to see
Some true opinions by me !

We didn't knit
We didn't like Elaine so much
We only surveyed the forums,
Didn't use them to keep in such close touch

(But here's the serious part)

No one's words will adequately explain this trip
How beautiful is was to be aboard this great ship
The "crowds" were like smiling, chatty family and to hear complaints is absurd
I never encountered any intolerable line, you can be sure

To suggest seats for friends or family not be saved...
How dare you tell us to behave...

We are all family on these trips
Gay or straight, It matters not a pip.....

(the rhyming stops here)

We gays want to be accepted into the world as one community,
It's ridiculous to descriminate on "our" cruise against straight folks...It a vacation that belongs to us as individuals, our families, our kids who will hopefully all grow up not to see any of the differences we see, it belongs to OUR family...human beings..not just gays or families....

I found one polite, smiling, embracing community on this trip, and if it was a town, I'd move right in !

I boarded the ship alone and left in the spiritual embrace of over a dozen new "family", gay and straight aged 6 to 66,
From West coast through Texas and Michigan to the East coast...

So, this is my very public thanks to:
Jean, Rebecca, M-E and Corey
Tim, Mike and Tommy
Michelle and Brad, Tara and Bill
Alisa
Tod and Ethan
Gina and Kathy
Blair, Tony and Alex

You've spoiled me for any other vacations...I won't go again unless I can take you all with me !!!

[KelliODonnell]

Thank you for that Nancy. I just got home and it made me giggle as i recover from my amazing week and jet lag.

Kelli

[MommyCheryl]

Here here! I was dismayed to hear complaints about so many "straight people" and saving seats for "straight people." Give me a break! Would your rear end have made it into the seat any easier if it had been reserved for a queer person? That's just silly. R family is inclusive. Heck, I'd be willing to bet that MANY of the children on board were straight. Oh, the shame. ;)

[kimgr]

From the minute I stepped foot in that ship I was overcome with emotion. I kept my sunglasses on so no one could see my tears. I couldnt stop observing all the people, gay, straight, grandparents, moms, dads, people with no kids, and the kids, every kid was beautiful, you name it we had it on The Happy Boat. I laughed so hard at times, I cried at times I was exhausted at times its what made this trip so special.

Unfortunately you will never make everyone happy, some of you complainers may want to consider a cruise with Dr Phil....
Seating schmeating, it all works out in the end, you cant tell me you dont wait for seating in a restaurant or theatre in your home towns!

Kelly, Greg, Rosie and the whole wonderful, talented, caring R Family team thank you for providing the most loving, diverse and safe environment I have ever been in. I made some new life friends and one very special friend is Papa Jim and his wonderful partner John and beautiful son Stephen. I thank you for this opportunity to meet some amazing people.

I also want to thank all of the entertainers and people that provided their time to teach. Susan Powter you are a gem, a crazy, fun gem that empowers so many people. Where else can you go to watch Cagey and Lacy with Sharon Gless sitting in the same room! How cool is that!
I can go on an on, it was amazing and we will be back!
Ok so does anyone feel like breaking out into the number " I had the time of my life...." :p

[margaret]

Let me see if I can put this in a way that makes sense....

I like straight people. I even love some straight people. Heck, everyone of my extended family except for me is straight. My kids give every indication of being straight. BUT, the difference in this cruise experience is that the gay families are almost all there to meet other families “like them”, so naturally, they are more outgoing and more approachable. The gay families really wanted to connect with each other, exchange stories, and find out where everyone was from.

The straight families, on the other hand, were almost all there with extended family groups...so already had a social network, and didn’t have the same need to meet other people. This is just my experience, but every time I sat down, or stood in line next to a gay family, there was always a conversation started. But the straight families seemed to very much stay to themselves. So, the larger number of straight people this year did shift the dynamic. Additionally, the crowds seemed to make people more pushy and cranky than in the past (not hugely so, but noticeable), again lessening the warm “family” atmosphere.

We all deal with lots of straight people every day in the “real” world. All I am saying is that it would be nice to have less of them on a “gay family” cruise.

The more I think about it, the more I believe that maybe it is the “first time” thing. It looks like most of those who posted how this was “the best vacation ever” are first timers. Last year when we returned from the cruise we thought it was the best time we’d had as a family, and couldn’t imagine not going on every future cruise. Perhaps with that background, there was no way that this year could hope to compare. But, I don’t see it as complaining as much as offering constructive criticism. Even though there was some disappointment this year, I am still a huge R Family fan...but if everyone is just a “yes man”, there is no way to affect change.

[MommyCheryl]

;) Hmm. Interesting thoughts. Though I will say that we had several extremely friendly and fun exchanges with straight family members on board. We met grandmas, siblings and parents traveling with gay families and they all seemed very outgoing. My expectations were never that it would be all gay, just that it would be all-accepting. And I certainly felt that. I almost felt sorry for some of the straight people onboard for being in what is normally our shoes -- the minority!

I suspect that some of what you all are feeling IS a let down from having such a great time then having overly high expectations. I also wonder if the itinerary wasn't a contributor -- much more time onboard for most folks than in warm-climate cruises. (Our weather was certainly warm enough!)

The bottom line is that I wouldn't want r family to discriminate based on sexual orientation -- I wouldn't go with them if they did. So complaining that there were more straight people on board isn't necessarily constructive -- what could they do to change that without discriminating?? Personally, I found it affirming and wonderful for me and my kids to see so many straight people who were so warm and loving and able to join in the big gay cruise without feeling their sexuality threatened.

[dylanmcd]

This is incredible. Imagine a "straight" cruise and complaints that there were gays!! I attended the essence festival last year in New Orleans - the largest gathering of african americans - sat in the superdome with approx 68,000 people of color - and about a dozen caucasians. Went because of the music. How sad i would have been to hear complaints of "white" people there. Perhaps you find it "natural" to want to be with your "own"...if you think about it...that way of thinking has produced every war ever known. You were surrounded by open, loving, accepting people -- all with the commonality of being human...of being on this earth for such a short time...don't let diversity ruin your time. becuase you don't want your diverstity to ruin the time of others. C;mon now!!!: mad:

[kimgr]

Margaret, you are going to take our community back 10 steps with your thoughts but I'll understand as you are entitled to your opinion and comments. Im sorry to hear your dissapointment.
On the other hand please dont burst my bubble, let me decide for myself next summer if this is a first time thing, somehow I doubt it. The thing that amazed me the most about this cruise was the diversity. R Family have created an environment for all to collaborate in peach and love. We need our straight friends on the cruise to get off that ship and tell all of their other freinds what a great time they had and how welcome they felt. Education is going to make the world a better place for us to be accepted.

[PAPAJIM]

:D I met the most amazing heterosexual people on board, including the couple whom were married on board. I met grandmas, executives, etc. Members of my chosen family are straight. I love all people-the only people on board whom I found distasteful were the militants and stuffy queens from our own tribal community. :mad:
Celebrate diversity-gay-straight. Thanks to God that We hooked up with so many amazing people. For the people that had a beef with the cruise and clientele, my suggestion is don't return. We have never experienced such amazing joy in our lifes. To all of my new hetero friends-much love and thanks for being a part of rfamily.:D

[KelliODonnell]

I feel strongly about being an inclusive company that is open to gay families. And within a family there are many straight friends and family members. Our cruise doors will always be open to those that have an open heart and mind.

I feel blessed to have so many beautiful grandparents, siblings and supportive friends sail the seas with us.

Best
Kelli

[24601]

Margaret, you are going to take our community back 10 steps with your thoughts but I'll understand as you are entitled to your opinion and comments. Im sorry to hear your dissapointment.
On the other hand please dont burst my bubble, let me decide for myself next summer if this is a first time thing, somehow I doubt it. The thing that amazed me the most about this cruise was the diversity. R Family have created an environment for all to collaborate in peach and love. We need our straight friends on the cruise to get off that ship and tell all of their other freinds what a great time they had and how welcome they felt. Education is going to make the world a better place for us to be accepted.

I'm so happy to be able to come to a place where people can express their opinions...and thank those like Margaret who feel comfortable voicing a very legitimate position. Before R Family was founded, we sailed many times with Olivia. However, I was really turned off by Olivia simply because on their online forums, non-supporting opinions are not allowed. The posts are deleted (and not because of offensive language or content, but because of comments about bad experiences on their vacations).

BTW, Kimgr, I don’t think that wanting more gay families on a vacation marketed to gay families is setting back the queer movement. Think of it this way...you go to your college reunion, and find that the same room is being used for a gathering of accountants. Sure, some of the accountants are very nice people, but having two groups there makes it harder to find your former classmates - the reason you came in the first place. That said, I’m going to be just as guilty as others who bring straight friends, as we’re planning a large group (60 and counting!) of mostly straight families for the 7-7-07 cruise.

[cisncat]

Let me see if I can put this in a way that makes sense....

I like straight people. I even love some straight people. Heck, everyone of my extended family except for me is straight. My kids give every indication of being straight. BUT, the difference in this cruise experience is that the gay families are almost all there to meet other families “like them”, so naturally, they are more outgoing and more approachable. The gay families really wanted to connect with each other, exchange stories, and find out where everyone was from.

The straight families, on the other hand, were almost all there with extended family groups...so already had a social network, and didn’t have the same need to meet other people. This is just my experience, but every time I sat down, or stood in line next to a gay family, there was always a conversation started. But the straight families seemed to very much stay to themselves. So, the larger number of straight people this year did shift the dynamic. Additionally, the crowds seemed to make people more pushy and cranky than in the past (not hugely so, but noticeable), again lessening the warm “family” atmosphere.

We all deal with lots of straight people every day in the “real” world. All I am saying is that it would be nice to have less of them on a “gay family” cruise.

The more I think about it, the more I believe that maybe it is the “first time” thing. It looks like most of those who posted how this was “the best vacation ever” are first timers. Last year when we returned from the cruise we thought it was the best time we’d had as a family, and couldn’t imagine not going on every future cruise. Perhaps with that background, there was no way that this year could hope to compare. But, I don’t see it as complaining as much as offering constructive criticism. Even though there was some disappointment this year, I am still a huge R Family fan...but if everyone is just a “yes man”, there is no way to affect change.

Margaret,

This isn't about separating us (the Queers) from them (the Straights) this is about people accepting one another for who we are, whatever we look like, do for a living, queer or straight. If we continue to segregate even on R FAMILY Vacations. When will it stop? We will only continue to perpetuate the madness of our society.

I brought my Straight mother-in-law on board, and let me tell you, she had no problem communicating with anyone, Queer or Straight. Some of you might remember Jackie with the Flag jacket.

The way I see it, the best way to affect change is by extending our hand and introducing ourselves.

Cathy

[schneidface]

I actually think I'm mourning a little...no drama intended. I decided to take a break to visit the forum to get a 'fix' and found a fascinating discussion. I cannot help but add my two cents. At least once each day I got lost in the emotion of seeing children, grandparents, parents...you name it...all just having a blast. We don't have children, but I told one of my sisters (straight with a husband and three beautiful children) that I was 100% certain her family would have loved the cruise and one day (lottery anyone?) I'd take them along with us to experience what I thought was the perfect community experience. This experience has made it impossible for me to even imagine taking anything but an r family cruise. I am not referring to the entertainment (although it was exceptional), the spoiling (a few lines v not cooking or cleaning?), the vista (our pics are good, but cannot come close to reality), or the exceptionally well managed details (I cannot help it...I'm a university administrator and notice goofy things). I am referring to the way it felt to be on that ship.

I have tried to verbalize the feeling for the last two days and I fall short each time. Describing the feelings of being aboard the Star have been like trying to describe Glacier Bay. Some things in life simply need to be experienced. OK, gotta go back to work! RSS

[PAPAJIM]

:D Again, celebrate deversity-celebrate each other and thank heaven that we are not back in the times of Stonewall. We do not need to be a union divided. On the cruise I heard some complaints but did not feed into them, everyone is entitled to their views and experience, I choose to be perpetualy happy and leave my glass half full. The people I met were exceptional and I embody them as a blessing. I even heard some disparaging comments regarding a plus size woman-I was appauled, the woman was a sweetheart and the person making the comment in front of her child was disheartening. We have enough hate in the world. We are a minority-adding prejudice within our own tribal community is very sad. To all that come on future cruises-enjoy and open yourself to the possibilities-it is a joy. I never thought comming on the cruise that I would become a friend of Susan Powter, for that I am so grateful. The staff of rfamily was exceptional as well as the cruise of the Norweigin Star. My son, my husband and I were blessed beyond words.
Esera was so exceptionaly kind to my son as was Susan and Keli. No one of celebrity status that I encountered was rude or uninviting except one person whom I care not to mention. I so look forward to the next summer cruise and being a proud happy member of Rfamily!:D

[MommyCheryl]

kimgr ... peach and love? Sounds like a drink I didn't have time to imbibe in :D

So glad to hear Kelli recommit to inclusivity. We're all people and I celebrate anyone who has the courage and wisdom to come celebrate that we are all part of the human family. We had some of our best conversations with the mother-in-law and wife of one of the Imagination Movers. Fantastic, warm and gracious people. That's "my" family. Sexual orientation isn't a requirement -- but human kindness is.

[kimgr]

kimgr ... peach and love? Sounds like a drink I didn't have time to imbibe in :D

So glad to hear Kelli recommit to inclusivity. We're all people and I celebrate anyone who has the courage and wisdom to come celebrate that we are all part of the human family. We had some of our best conversations with the mother-in-law and wife of one of the Imagination Movers. Fantastic, warm and gracious people. That's "my" family. Sexual orientation isn't a requirement -- but human kindness is.


Peach and love, good lord I am still slurring! Should be peace and love, so much for being serious! ;)

[K&T Cali]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the woman (her name escapes me) who filmed the documentary about the ship straight?? I think she is one straight person that everyone is happy to have had on the first trip! And, I would bet that some of the gay people on this trip never would have heard about it if it wasn't for this straight woman!

[margaret]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the woman (her name escapes me) who filmed the documentary about the ship straight?? I think she is one straight person that everyone is happy to have had on the first trip! And, I would bet that some of the gay people on this trip never would have heard about it if it wasn't for this straight woman!

One last time...I NEVER SAID THAT I DISLIKE STRAIGHT PEOPLE. In fact, I said that I like them. I am simply voicing my PERSONAL opinion that I would prefer the balance onboard a gay family cruise to be in favor of gay families, as I see it tipping the other way. I never said we should eliminate all the straight people, my thought is maybe to give a month or two of booking preference to gay families. Clearly, this should not be taken personally by anyone, and I simply cannot see how it is offensive. It is just one person’s opinion, and I am in no way saying that those that think otherwise are bad or wrong. Besides, there really isn’t anything that can be done about it, as this is a free country (at least for the time being), and R Family is a business. Smart businesses should make money from whomever is willing to pay, and in my opinion, R Family doesn't charge enough for the great experience they offer.

Yes, I know that many straight people have contributed greatly to the world and some even help queer causes, which is wonderful. Wasn’t the idea of R Family in the first place to create a trip where gay families were in the majority? I wouldn’t be at all surprised to find that is not the case within a couple of years. In fact, according to this article, it’s already 50/50...

http://www.rfamilyvacations.com/news/pdfs/NYTimes_Rosie.pdf

[ColoradoDad]

I just wrote this huge post about a thought I had concerning the talk going on about the increasing number of straight people coming on the cruises. Then I realized it was many thoughts and rambled like I tend to do so I ditched it :) It really boiled down to one thing for me - My family had an amazing experience meeting other families just like ours which is something we just don't get the opportunity to do a lot where we live. If more and more straight people come on because they heard great things about the cruise... that's fine, the more people the merrier :D ... and Kelli was absolutely right about committing RFamily to be all-inclusive. But personally, if it ever changed to the point where I felt the unique focus of this trip just wasn't there anymore, I probably wouldn't be as inclined to come. But hey, it certainly wasn't an issue for us in Alaska - it was a fantastic cruise and something we hope to repeat for years to come.

[MommyCheryl]

I guess I'm confused. We met very few (in relation to the number of total people onboard) straight people on the cruise. Those we did meet were very accepting and with one exception had either gay friends or family onboard. I think the perception that people are straight-bashing comes from the fact that I suspect most of us didn't feel the balance was anywhere near tipping to even 50-50. In fact, I'd guess more than 80 percent of the non-crew folks were gay (or children).

I think it will always be gay-flavored because that's who it's marketed to. But really, how would you feel about Norwegian, for example, if on their "straight" cruises they allowed gays but only after giving straight people a three month exclusive sign-up period?

Maybe I'm missing it but did people seriously feel the straights were overrunning the place??

For me, it's all about love and acceptance. If others can love and accept my family, I'll love and accept theirs, on the ship, on land and in the air. I just liked not having to explain that no, my kids don't have a father, we're both the moms, etc. And everyone on board "got" it.

I don't mean this to imply that those who feel differently should keep quiet -- I'm really interested in how others experienced something so completely different than I did vis a vis the proportion of straight but not narrow folks on board....

[KelliODonnell]

We have about 50/50 men versus women on board. And about 10 percent of our passengers were straight friends and family.

Thanks
Kelli

[immikeymcc]

I think the cruise was perfect in every way. The mix of people, gay, straight, and otherwise. I don't think there should be any limitations on passengers other than they are supportive of their gay friends and family. By the way, the notion that it's only the first timer's who didn't notice, is wrong. My family are all "3's" and we thought this year was just as good as the previous two, if not better.

I think the dynamic Kelly pointed out was great. 50% Male/50% Female and 10% straight. Isn't that what the gay community experiences? 90% straight world, 10% gay world? Interesting numbers, if nothing else.

[MommyCheryl]

Thanks, Kelli, for the statistics. I was starting to think my "straight-dar" was off or something. ;) But what you reported feels exactly right to what my experience was.

Did I mention that it was a fantastic, magical experience??

I will only add that if the idea of issuing tickets to shows comes to fruition at some point, please issue individual tickets, not cabin tickets. My wife and I split the shows at least once to take care of the kids but make sure we both got to see the show!

[jeanne59]

Nancy,

This is Queer.. you and I meeting here
But I saw your message and felt the beat
Of all that WAS just last week.

You put into words.. and made them rhyme
All about the our SMASHing great time

Ok enough!!!

You made old Chang-a-long shed a tear. Hope to hear from you often but just not Here
Send email

jeanne

[jblksmith1]

I never once looked at the people on the cruise as straight, gay, married, single, with children or without. All I saw day and night were beautiful people. Kind, loving, happy, beautiful people. Kelli, Greg, Rosie, and all the RFamily crew...it was "All because of you".

[Jaye Lewis]

I hate to be the voice of hopeless diplomacy, but I understand and support both sides of the conversation. I knew that extended families were there but it didn't occur to me that any of these "happy and gay" folks before me were straight. It would be cool to have a PFLAG meet-n-greet. My own personal goal was to show my two 9 y/o's that they were going to spend a week with a thousand kids with parent/families just like theirs. Without taking a headcount, I easily proved my point.

Maybe to expand on the "Dress your State" theme; a nudge to ID your city, grouped (NYer's on the bow) to more easily take some friendships home with you.

I do have a significant complaint however, and that is that no one should have to endure the taunts of hot chocolate-chip cookies and milk day after day after day...and who am I to appear ungrateful?

[watergurl]

As a straight woman on her second R family cruise, let me say that I was so HONORED to be a part of this celebration. I thought i came with an already open mind and heart, but my fellow cruisers - you open me up more than i thought possible. I often wondered how I was perceived on the boat, wondered if people resented me being there. To make up for it, I see myself as an ambassador of sorts... - I am able to educate my friends and family about this cruise and its role and importance and correct so many misunderstandings about gay families in general. (they have children! by lots of different methods! just like us! and they have long long long lasting loving relationships! just like us! and they want to hold hands with their partner when on vacation! just like us!.....).
As long as I am welcome and able to come, I will be there. I learn so much on this cruise - about myself, families, relationships.
As a straight woman on a gay family cruise - please know that I never took a second of it for granted. I realized early that being part of the 10% heterosexual minority was what homesexual people must feel EVERY DAY - and i loved the experience of the switch.
thank you for sharing your stories with me, letting me play with your children, answering my questions, partying with me, teaching me and journeying with me!

[ourtribe]

;) watergurl, ROCK ON ! ;)

This is the stuff that exstingushes wars and bridges gaps between mankind!

[kimgr]

Watergurl - thank you!
In my opinion, word of mouth is one of the best ways to get a message out there. This is what I was saying earlier, and Im not saying anyone on the cruise did not approve of straight people being on the ship, but if the straight folk had a good time and felt welcome then they will be our educators out there in the world by telling others.
People like you Watergurl are going to help make our communities come together and be accepting of each other.
Thanks again and I hope to meet you on a future cruise! :)

[meachan]

As a straight person who had the honor to be invited with a performing group, I just want to say that this was one of the most incredible vacations I've ever had. This cruise was "done right" in so many ways, and I felt priveleged to be included. People we met on the cruise and excursions, gay or straight, were wonderful and I enjoyed spending time with so many people and sharing these experiences with them. Indeed, I thought it wasn't an issue until I read this. I just thought I'd weigh in and say "peach and love" to all! And rFamily is awesome! Oh, and I am telling all my friends and family how great it was.